Natalie Barr, Co-host: A major wakeup call is being issued this morning after Australia's top spy chief revealed China's cyber soldiers could inflict high-impact sabotage on some of our most critical infrastructure.
Matt Shirvington, Co-host: Mike Burgess is sounding the alarm now, urging industry leaders to harden their systems and protect sensitive data. ASIO is bracing for major disruption costing Aussies billions of dollars each and every year. For more, Foreign Minister Penny Wong joins us now live. Great to have you with us. So, how prepared are we to deal with this type of threat?
Penny Wong, Foreign Minister: Good morning, Shirvo. Good morning, Nat. It's good to be with you. Obviously, cybersecurity is one of the new frontiers of disruption, and we've been very aware of that, both in terms of how we look at critical infrastructure, but also the work that we do with the private sector to work to harden their defences against both state and non-state actors. We've seen cyber incursions, we've seen, you know, people, we've seen the hacking of systems. We know that this is a resilience that we have to have in government, but also in the private sector.
Barr: It feels like we're having data leaks more and more and the whole Triple Zero fiasco. So, how can we be sure that China is not going to come in and hack something tomorrow?
Foreign Minister: I think we can be sure that we will continue to see cybersecurity incidents from both non-state actors and others. I mean, we know that, and that's part of what Mike Burgess is saying, but it's also what the government's been saying. We need to do more to harden our cybersecurity. There's a lot more to do, but the government has been working very closely, as you know, with the private sector to try and harden our defences.
Shirvington: From an economic standpoint, $12.5 billion in 2024, I mean, it's costing us a lot of money.
Foreign Minister: There are enormous costs associated with data leaks. There's enormous costs associated for both government and companies associated with cybersecurity. But that is now part of what it means to do business in this world. We have to expect that we will see individuals and groups trying to get inside our systems and we have to work to prevent it.
Barr: On the other side of the spectrum, the Liberals obviously talking about Net Zero, trying to work out their position. Do you guys sort of sit back and say, oh, look, that's bought us another term. You're pretty happy about what they're doing?
Foreign Minister: We've seen, Australians have seen, 15 years of the climate wars inside the Coalition and what that has meant is higher energy prices. I mean, what happens when you have policy uncertainty is the private sector doesn't invest. You might know that 24 out of 28 coal-fired power stations under the Coalition government said we're going to close. We are providing policy certainty. We are working on the energy transition. We are clear about the need to make our energy system more reliable and over time to continue to bring down wholesale prices by investing in renewables. What we see on the other side is a recipe for higher energy prices and more leadership chaos.
Shirvington: Penny Wong, thanks for your time this morning. Appreciate it.
Foreign Minister: Good to speak with you