Nikolai Beilharz, Host: The Federal Foreign Minister, Foreign Affairs Minister and South Australian Senator Penny Wong has a lot on her plate. She's in Fiji at the moment working on continuing to build Pacific relations, but of course is keeping a close eye on the ongoing conflict in Iran as well. And has been good enough to take the time to join us this afternoon. Penny Wong, thank you for your time.
Penny Wong, Foreign Minister: Well, it's good to be with you, Nicolai. I hope Adelaide's going well.
Beilharz: It's lovely. A little bit rainy. Probably not the same as what's happening in Fiji. And we'll get to what's going on in Fiji in a moment. But can we start with the Middle East, because of course, that is just a situation that continues to evolve. We have seen that the US Secretary of State Marco Rubio has said Operation Epic Fury has concluded, Project Freedom is now underway, which is kind of aiming to open the Strait of Hormuz. That now has been put on pause to try and get a peace deal done. Do you take that as a genuine step towards peace?
Foreign Minister: We've been saying for some time that we needed to see de-escalation and a return to negotiations. We've also been saying that the US had largely achieved its military objectives and that's consistent with what Secretary Rubio has pointed out in the last 24 hours. So we support efforts by the US to engage in these discussions with Iran because ultimately, keeping the Strait open and the world wants to see that, will require engagement and a diplomatic resolution in order to see the oil flow.
Beilharz: How fragile are those negotiations at the moment in terms of the ceasefire holding?
Foreign Minister: Obviously, we're not part of these discussions and I think it's quite self-evident that it's a fairly tenuous situation. And you've seen the ceasefire, it's demonstrably fragile. You've seen breaches of it, you've seen action being taken. But as I said when the ceasefire was first put in place, the ceasefire is fragile but the world needs it to hold. You know that we've seen an unprecedented impact on global energy markets which have flowed all the way through to the servos in Adelaide and to regional areas, where diesel is needed for the agricultural sector. So our economy, the world economy, does need this to be resolved.
Beilharz: I'm glad you mentioned fuel prices, because of course they have come back from those extreme highs that we saw, which is thanks in at least part to the excise reductions that we've seen. Do you have a concern that for the average person in Australia, that was kind of the most direct link they saw to a conflict that feels like it's a very long way away and there may be a bit of a false sense of security about the current situation.
Foreign Minister: Look, I have a concern that people are doing it tough and that you've seen, not just the bowser price increase, although as you said, it's eased off in part because of the excise reduction, but the increases to energy prices flow through to all parts of our economy and all parts of our lives. So, you've seen consumer goods and food obviously potentially impacted. We were very conscious of that as a government, which is why so much of my work in recent times has been working to leverage our relationships to try and assure more fuel supply, at a time where we know a lot of the fuel coming to our region has been blocked. 20% of the world's oil goes through the strait, but 80% of the oil to our region. And so that means that the Indo-Pacific, the region we live in, has been a lot more affected. And that's why you've seen the PM and myself and others working to try and get more supply and also the government's efforts to try and relieve some of the price impact.
Beilharz: I mentioned that you're in Fiji at the moment. As part of that, you have just announced in the past few hours, on the fuel side of things, Australia will be giving $30 million to Fiji.
Foreign Minister: Yeah, we've provided $30 million in targeted budget support to assist Fiji's fuel response from within our existing aid budget. And that's reflecting our partnership with them. We want to see, we take the view, as the government, and I think Australians understand this, that ultimately Australia's interests are in a stable, secure region, and so we have an interest in the security and stability of our neighbours. That's why we work so hard with the countries of the Pacific.
Beilharz: It has been described that part of the efforts the Federal Government is undertaking, though, is to try and contain China's growing influence. Is that a fair assessment?
Foreign Minister: I've been upfront with Australians that, I've described us being in permanent contest in the Pacific, and that we have to work very hard to be the partner of choice. And I've explained why we want to be the partner of choice or a partner of choice. We want that because our security and our stability are grounded in, are located in, our region. So, if you have more trusted, respectful partnerships with the countries of your region, that obviously ensures you have stability and security in the region around you. That's why we're here. That's why we're working hard with Fiji, it's a really important partner for us. And it's why you've seen the Prime Minister, me, Richard Marles, so many Ministers in the region over the last few years.
Beilharz: When it comes to being that partner of choice, how direct is the correlation between achieving that and really, financial contributions? Or is it more than that?
Foreign Minister: We're already a very large contributor to Pacific development, but ultimately this is about the region being a region of peace. And part of that is working with people on development. But part of that is also making sure that what Pacific leaders agreed, that security be provided from within the Pacific, is respected.
Beilharz: So, it can be, it's not mutually exclusive. It's not Australia or China. Or is the reality that at some point nations will choose?
Foreign Minister: We want to be, you know, we're a member of the Pacific family. We're a member of the Pacific Forum, that's the regional body. And that forum, leaders of that have said security should be provided from within Forum members. And that's a position Australia takes because we see that as being how you ensure and assure stability. Make sure that security is provided by members of the Pacific Forum.
Beilharz: 13 past four is the time. 891 ABC, Adelaide. You're hearing from Penny Wong, the Federal Foreign Affairs Minister. On that note of security, Penny Wong, how concerned are you about organised criminal activity taking place in not just Fiji, but the broader region?
Foreign Minister: That's been a big focus of our discussions, that transnational crime, in particular the trafficking of illicit substances and drugs through the region, has dramatically increased. That's a big focus of the discussions. And we are looking at what more we can do together. We already do a lot together, and that's in all of our interests. It's in the interest of the countries of the region. It's also in Australia's interest, because much of that is destined for Australia. And so, the more we can disrupt these illicit supply chains and the more we can work together to make sure we don't have drugs going through the region and drugs coming to Australia, the better.
Beilharz: What else is on the table for this trip? What else are you hoping to achieve?
Foreign Minister: I announced today that we have agreed that we will enter into a treaty, that we have the intention of entering into a treaty. We've got more work to do on what that looks like, but I think that is a really important step in our relationship. It's the next step. We have a partnership at the moment, but to elevate that to make it a much bigger deal that lasts beyond whoever's in government in both countries, that will be a big thing.
Beilharz: What could that entail? Is it more the potential that there will be more binding deals done?
Foreign Minister: Yes we're focused on security, but also on development and on people. And it's recognising our partnership and strengthening those ties with Fiji. And Fiji is a very, as I said, it's one of the larger economies, larger countries in the region and they are central to a peaceful, stable, prosperous Pacific. And this adds to our relationship with PNG, which is obviously another very important Pacific partner.
Beilharz: Penny Wong, thank you for your time this afternoon.
Foreign Minister: Really good to speak with you. Thanks.