Joint Press Conference, Bali Process Ministerial Conference

Transcript, E&OE, proof only

30 March 2011

Minister Natalegawa: [Opening statement in Indonesia]

Minister Natalegawa: Kevin and Chris, I was saying just now that we have had a very good discussion throughout today on the Bali Process dealing with the issue of people smuggling, human trafficking and other related transnational crimes.

I have explained to my colleagues that the outcome of the conference is reflected admirably in the Chairman's statement so I will not go into that Chairman's statement except to reinforce one key message, namely how the process that Indonesia and Australia began back in 2002 has now become very much a part of the region's architecture in dealing with this common vice and common challenge namely the challenge of people smuggling, human trafficking and other relevant transnational crime.

What struck me most, among other things, during the course of our discussions today, was how all of us countries participating in the process are one in recognizing these are the sort of challenges that demand common efforts that define national solutions and that requires all of us to work hand in hand in overcoming that. Especially I thought there was a recognition that the challenge of people smuggling and the challenge of human trafficking are very much related, as well as the other dimensions and other forms of transnational problems as well.

We are confident that as a result of our deliberations today, we have really strengthened the possibility of our further collaboration ahead and actually the Chairman's statement provides for real concrete actionable steps that countries participating in the Bali Process can carry out next year, throughout the year to ensure that the very challenges that we have identified can be overcome in a good way. By way of my own introductory remarks, I would now like to hand over the floor to Kevin who would like to say a few words as well.

Minister Rudd: Good afternoon, thank you Pak Marty and good afternoon ladies and gentlemen.

Legal and illegal migration represents a global challenge; it represents a regional challenge; it represents a national challenge.  As the IOM advises today the people of the world are now on the move more than any other time in human history. In any one year today we have nearly one billion of the world's family on the move; a quarter of whom are engaged in international migration; three quarters of whom are engaged in internal migration. This is therefore creating enormous pressures on all of our national systems, regional systems and global institutions. Around the world right now we have some 41 million people who are displaced internally or internationally. 15.9 million of those are refugees. And here in our own region we have some 3.9 million. This is a large challenge in our region therefore as well.

Because of the dimensions of this challenge, right now across the world there are 15 regional groupings engaged in deliberations of the type we are engaged in, in our part of the world. And that is because across the world and the various regions of the world, people have concluded that the response to these challenges must be regional and they lie beyond the scope and power of any individual nation state to deal with alone. What we have therefore in this co-chairman statement today, which has just achieved the support of the participating states in the conference we are holding here in Bali, is the first regional framework for cooperation agreed among any of these regions in the world.

This is an important achievement.

What specifically does this regional cooperation framework do? Firstly it commits participating states to the elimination of people smuggling or to paraphrase the language of the document itself, to undermine the people smuggling business model. Second, it commits participating states where possible to the harmonization of regional arrangements to the establishment of regional assessment arrangements including the possibility of a regional centre or regional centres. It also provides for the proper handling of those deemed to be refugees, it also provides for the returning of those found not to be refugees; and all done in a manner compatible with the relevant international standards. This regional framework agreement has therefore been supported by both the UNHCR and by the IOM.

Finally this regional cooperation framework now creates the basis for specific measures to be adopted between individual states within our region, including the possibility of harmonized regional assessment arrangements including the possibility of a regional centre or regional centres. Therefore the fact that this regional protection framework, this regional cooperation framework has been agreed, here's a critical step forward in our region's response to the challenge of people smuggling, to the challenge of illegal migration, to the challenge of proper protection.

Two final points; also within the remit of this conference is important work in the area of human trafficking. This is a huge challenge for our region as well. Listening to delegates this morning from Cambodia, from Thailand and from other countries report on the measures they are taking to deal with this appalling crime, reinforces our determination as a group of states to heighten our efforts in dealing with human trafficking. We have resolved to make this a further area of strong emphasis for our work at the next Bali conference. Also the contributions from various member states underline the absolute importance of dealing with people smuggling, human trafficking, the narcotics trade and other elements of transnational crime as a combined or collective or total challenge. That is that we need to coordinate our resources across the board rather than simply concentrate on a single part of it. This will require unprecedented cooperation between agencies within states and unprecedented cooperation between states as all these crimes are linked one to the other.

My final point is this, none of the achievements that we have recorded in this Bali conference would have been possible without the co-chairmanship of Indonesia and my good friend and colleague the Foreign Minister of Indonesia Marty Natalegawa. Indonesia's co-hosting of this conference for the last four of them has been vital, the co-hosting of this conference and the work of officials in delivering this outcome has been vital and I would like to publicly thank and acknowledge the Republic of Indonesia for its support for this process.

To conclude, I would also like to add that in Jakarta yesterday I had the opportunity and again today with others to discuss the future of the East Asian Summit as well. In meetings yesterday with President Yudhoyono of Indonesia, with the Foreign Minster of Indonesia and today with the Foreign Minister of Thailand we look forward very much to Indonesia's hosting of this important regional institutional event later this year and Australia stands ready to support our good friends in Indonesia in making sure that this East Asian Summit is a success and together we help craft a new robust institution for the future of our wider region.

Having said that, Chris, you may wish to add some remarks.

Minister Bowen: Thank you Kevin and thank you Pak Marty.

Today is a significant result if you look at the communiqués and such statements of the chairs of previous Bali process meetings; this is without doubt the most significant of the last ten years.

Australia came to this meeting seeking a regional framework.

We weren't sure we would get it but we were very pleased with the agreement which has been reached that a regional agreement is being entered into by the members of the Bali process. This is a very significant step forward.

Today the Bali Process members outlined the architecture of the framework. It is now open for bilateral discussions to fill in the details, to build the walls of the regional agreement that has been laid out by members today. If you look at the statements from the co-chairs and the agreement from all nations to work together to tackle the people smuggling, particularly the measures envisaged in paragraph 16 and 19 of the statement of the co-chairs. This is very significant step forward and like Kevin, I thank Pak Marty and every delegate, every minister and representative of the nations represented around the table today.

Having so many nations in the room has not always lent itself to reaching an agreement, a unanimous agreement, but we were able to reach it today.

I said previously that Australia believes we need a regional solution to a regional problem. Today we have taken a step, a significant step towards that I've said before that nobody should doubt the resolve of the Australian Government to reach that agreement and to take concrete steps within that framework. That agreement reached today re-doubles our resolve to do so and to ensure that we are able to work together with our regional colleagues in terms of the regional agreement struck today to break the business model of the people smugglers.

Like Kevin and Pak Marty, I would like to thank all the delegates today, all the senior officials who on our behalf have been discussing what would be put to us today and thank everybody for the cooperative attitude of consensus and unanimous result that we have achieved in the room today. Thanks you very much Kevin and Pak Marty.

Minister Natalegawa: We can take a few questions perhaps..

Journalist: Pak Marty, Minister Rudd and Minister Bowen, Matt Brown from the ABC — question for Minister Rudd — East Timor's Vice Foreign Minister has told us today than even in light of this agreement that you have struck today, East Timor isn't interested in hosting a regional processing centre and that East Timor would rather that Australia look elsewhere for that processing centre.

Is that the end of your attempts to negotiate a processing centre in East Timor and will you look elsewhere?

Minister Rudd: In our discussions with the Vice Foreign Minister of East Timor he indicated that this matter had yet to be deliberated upon by the Council of Ministers in East Timor. So we will wait for the outcome of those deliberations.

Secondly, as I have said repeatedly in the Australian parliament, these are legitimate matters of national debate in any country, in any democracy, including in East Timor and thirdly therefore, we will wait for the conclusion of those deliberations to go back to what I said before, and Chris may want to add to this, the importance of this regional cooperation framework is that it provides the possibility within it for participating states if they so choose, to embrace and harmonize regional processing arrangements including the possibility of a regional centre or regional centers.

Minister Bowen: Well simply to add the Bali Process does have the respect of the Asia Pacific region and many nations have expressed a view that such an endorsement as we have received today would be a necessary step in the development of a centre and other bilateral proposals.

Of course we have said that East Timor would be the focus of our discussions and they have been, but today the very significant step in the development of those discussions across our region and then lays the framework for further bilateral discussions.

Journalist: Just on the questions of those discussions with East Timor; you said recently that the discussions will take place bilaterally and not as part of a broader regional framework [inaudible] East Timor is not interested in bilateral discussions and that this issue should be resolved in the context of the Bali Process. Where does that leave you?

Minister Bowen: Well let me say this: Very clearly, I have said continuously, there are a range of views in the East Timorese Government about how to handle this. It is a controversial issue in East Timor as you would expect. Certainly the communication we have received from the highest levels of the East Timorese Government is that the discussions should continue, not underestimating the difficulty of those discussions for East Timor and the controversial nature of them within East Timor. We are happy to continue those discussions and of course the agreement reached today enables discussions to continue across the Board in relation to the set of arrangements envisaged by the regional framework.

Clearly, I flagged some time ago Paul, to you and your paper, and I read your story today but I flagged some time ago that this meeting would not be resolving the geographic location of any assessment centre, but we have taken significant step forward today in the endorsing the concept of an assessment centre as a potential part of the framework.

I have flagged that some time ago with respect to your story today that this would not be something, that the geographical location would not be something, on the agenda of ministers this morning

Journalist: What other nations then might you discuss regional centres with, and have you discussed it with any?

Minister Bowen: I repeat, East Timor has been the focus of our discussions, of course we discuss a number of issues with bilateral nations all the time but East Timor has been the focus of our discussions about an assessment centre.

Journalist: [Question in Indonesian]

Minister Natalegawa: [Response in Indonesian]

Minister Rudd: Just to add something to that, and then we will come back to that next question if that is alright.

I understand from the interpretation that the question dealt with why the conference didn't deal with the source countries and why we are primarily dealing with destination countries and reference was made to the particular example of Libya.

Can I just say for everyone else in the room — one, and backing up what I think Pak Marty had to say, is that the conference dealt at length with the fact that the challenge of asylum seekers is dynamic and is not static. There are new source countries emerging all the time, new destination countries emerging all the time.

Secondly, on the current example of Libya, let me underline one fact, the Government of Australia is currently globally the third largest financial contributor to the humanitarian effort in Libya now, primarily through the agencies of the IOM and UNHCR to get people out and therefore having spoken to the Foreign Minister of Bangladesh and others who expressed their appreciation for our support, getting literally tens of thousands of people out of that zone.

Were they not to be returned to their countries of origin then we would have a massive refugee problem on our hands. However our sense of international obligation extends to being significant, the third largest in the world of financial contributors to a source country problem right now.

Journalist: An unrelated question to both Pak Marty and Minister Rudd, can either of you confirm the arrest in Pakistan of Umar Patek?

Minister Rudd: I will let Pak Marty speak for himself but for us, it is clear that Patek has been arrested.

Furthermore it is our view that Patek's arrest is potentially a major step forward in the fight against terrorism.

His arrest might offer some small comfort to the nearly 100 Australian families who lost loved ones in the Bali bombings way back in 2002. Of course his arrest does not bring anyone back.

I would also say that Patek has been one of Indonesia's most wanted terrorists for a long time; one of the last Bali bombers so accused still at large. We therefore will be in the closest liaison with our friends in Pakistan and our friends in Indonesia on what happens next in relation to this particular case.

Minister Natalegawa: Let me just say, on Umar Patek, obviously he is a person of interest to Indonesia.

He has been and we have been pursuing him irrespective of his geographical whereabouts but for operational purposes, not wanting at the same time to reject what Minister Rudd has said, I can not confirm that fact but having said that, it is more for operational purposes that I can not confirm that fact. Because our interests extend beyond this arrest, the arrest of Umar Patek, but our interests also extend to include the disruption of the network that he represents, that he is part of, and therefore even if we say for the sake of argument that he has been arrested, our interest is not only in this arrest but also in getting as much information out of him before the possibilities become jeopardized by his confirmation.

Journalist: Just a quick follow up question for Mr Rudd, Indonesia is sending a team over, they're going to do dna testing and that kind of thing. Does Australia have its own reporting that confirms the arrest of Umar Patek?

Minister Rudd: We do not comment on intelligence matters.

I have simply responded according to what is the appropriate set of circumstances as they present themselves to us now. Beyond the matters which I have just referred to, which relate to Pakistan, these matters also of course are subject to separate complimentary statements by the Indonesian Government concerning the Government of Indonesia and I would not seek to cut across anything Pak Marty has to say either. We have discussed these matters in some detail before this press conference just now. However, the matters that I raised before are obviously a big concern to the Australian people and it follows as a matter of course that we follow these matters deeply at the level of the Australian Government and will continue to remain engaged with our friends both in Indonesia and in Islamabad.

Journalist: Could you please be more specific, we haven't heard any specifics on either agreements or commitments that have been made, or could have been made, at the forum? Are there any messages that you would like for the participant countries, particularly those from origin countries because what we have heard so far is mostly about are measures taken by the transit countries and the destination countries.

Minister Bowen: Well as I said before, this framework lays out the architecture for further agreements. It was a very clear view in the room that this was a significant step forward. There was discussion around the table, not only on transit countries but matters that could be taken into account for source countries and destination countries, and agreements between all three types of countries, the types of measures that I said before were anticipated in paragraphs 16 and 19 of the co-chair statement. So the process for today was to lay out the framework to enable those further agreements to be entered into under that framework and these are not agreements that would have been possible before this framework had been agreed to today by the ministers around the table.

Journalist: But what are the specific measures that should be taken by origin countries [inaudible]

Minister Bowen: In terms of origin countries, certainly matters that were discussed today by ministers went to education campaigns about the dangers and illegality of irregular movement, about the implications of irregular movement and certainly working together to deal with matters of economic migration. These are the sorts of things that ministers flagged in their discussions today and of course in relation to transit and destination countries, of course there is a range of matters that were anticipated by the co-chairs' statement including more robust return arrangements etc.

Journalist: [Question in Indonesian]

Minister Natalegawa: [Response in Indonesian]

Minister Rudd: To add one point to what Pak Marty has said on the question of work against terrorist operations in the region.

Australia remains fully engaged with our friends in Indonesia on the challenge of terrorism in this part of the world.

The fact that these matters do not necessarily obtain daily media coverage does not mean that on a daily basis this cooperative activity is not underway in detail at an operational level involving our relevant agencies and has continued as such for many, many years and continues that way. 

Minister Natalegawa: Thanks very much.

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