Interview with Virginia Trioli, ABC 24 Breakfast

Subject: Egypt, Cyclone Yasi

Transcript, E&OE, proof only

4 February 2011

MICHAEL ROWLAND: Now, let's head overseas to still the other major story this week, and that is the situation in Egypt which isn't getting any better at all. The country's Opposition has suspended talks with the government over those violent clashes in Cairo. They're accusing President Hosni Mubarak's regime of backing the violence.

VIRGINIA TRIOLI: The Egyptian army has finally intervened to keep the warring sides apart to some extent, and the regime is cracking down on the foreign media, with reports of media crews being harassed and journalists being rounded up. For Australia's response to the situation, Foreign Affairs Minister Kevin Rudd is in Munich and he joins us now. Kevin Rudd, good morning and thanks so much.

KEVIN RUDD: Good morning, good to be with you.

VIRGINIA TRIOLI: What's the situation of the Australians remaining in Egypt, in Cairo. Do you know how many are left and how many are still to board any flights?

KEVIN RUDD: Yes. I've been speaking today with, obviously, our consular emergency centre in Canberra, but also with our ambassador in Cairo. A large number of Australians have gathered at Cairo Airport for the next flight out. A number - a smaller number of Australians, some 20 or 30, have remained in - at a hotel in the city, for the simple reason that, at this stage, it is being judged to be too difficult and, possibly, too dangerous to travel from the hotel in the city through to the airport. However, what we have done is make sure that those at the airport are accommodated at a hotel at the airport, supplied by the government, and, similarly, those who have remained in town with embassy officials there are also accommodated in a way which has been arranged by the government. And we will take each step carefully and methodically, as is necessary, to secure the safety of all Australians.

VIRGINIA TRIOLI: So, as you read the situation, those 30 who are still holed up in a hotel in Cairo, they're largely okay and will continue to be okay for some time, that that situation can continue?

KEVIN RUDD: I checked that specifically with our Ambassador today. These 20 to 30 Australians are, of course, also living with Australian embassy officials in the same hotel. So we are together with them. And it's close by the Australian - the Australian Embassy. Could I also indicate that on the broader question of developments in Egypt, a couple of hours ago, I spoke directly to the Egyptian Foreign Minister in Cairo and raised a number of specific concerns.

Firstly, concerning violence, which we saw on our television screens yesterday being meted out to protesters in the central square in Cairo, I reminded him that the view of all governments, all western governments, including the German Foreign Minister and others, is that this violence cannot continue. It will only inflame the situation. I also said, and consistent with what the Germans and others have said to him, that the political reform process must begin now.

I also said to him that in terms of our Australians who have yet to leave the country and yet to be delivered to the airport, that we will need their support in order to accomplish that mission, and I put him on notice on that question. And finally, what I also indicated to him was that the reports that we have now received from far and wide across the world about the attacks on journalists, this behaviour is simply unacceptable to the Australian Government, to governments throughout Europe, to governments throughout the world and it must stop.

VIRGINIA TRIOLI: And what did he say in reply? Did he say anything that was credible or reassuring?

KEVIN RUDD: Well, on each of those points, he provided a response. Diplomatic conversations are to remain confidential, but…

VIRGINIA TRIOLI: But did you believe him?

KEVIN RUDD: … the Foreign Minister was left in no doubt about the Australian - the Australian Government's position. I've also been watching developments in terms of the statement given today by Vice President Suleiman, through the Egyptian state-controlled media, and I raised specific of my concerns again with the Foreign Minister concerning what the Vice President had said today. What I'm most concerned about, in terms of overall stability in the streets of Cairo in the next 24 hours, is the prospective actions of the Egyptian military.

What is clear, in terms of the conversation I've had with the Foreign Minister, and from other indications that I've received, is that the police and other security forces have withdrawn from the streets, thereby leaving, primarily, the Egyptian military in control.

Therefore, it is imperative tomorrow that they separate [indistinct] troops and maintain restraint in dealing with the protesters in the square.

VIRGINIA TRIOLI: Is it also clear to you, Minister Rudd, that so many of those pro-Mubarak protesters are, in the blunt terms of many media reports, simply paid thugs by the Mubarak regime. Is that clear to you too?

KEVIN RUDD: Well, I've spoken at length with our embassy analysts about this in Cairo as well and looked at other reporting on this. Put it this way, some of the activities to us seem to be far from spontaneous, and we are deeply concerned about that as well. The other thing I would say, however, is that law and order in the middle of Cairo at the moment is not under control. Therefore, it is possible that you actually have vigilante groups as well. And we have had some difficulties with that ourselves in terms of Australian Embassy officials seeking safe passage for themselves to Cairo Airport from our embassy downtown.

We've been monitoring this closely throughout the day. It's been a difficult day for our embassy officials in Cairo. And they - all 20 or 30 of them, and more - have been doing a terrific job under great pressure.

VIRGINIA TRIOLI: Do you have any concerns for their safety? Is there any consideration being given to pulling Australian Embassy staff out of Cairo?

KEVIN RUDD: We, some time ago - when this began to develop, and over the course of last week, we obtained the departure of one or two dependents. Some dependents have chosen to remain within the country. But by and large, the advice is that our embassy officials are safe and secure and that is the advice that we have received.

VIRGINIA TRIOLI: Okay.

KEVIN RUDD: And I know that they are sufficiently professional to want to remain there in order to assist this last group of Australians in search of evacuation.

VIRGINIA TRIOLI: Can I just get some clarity from you this morning, if I can, Minister Rudd, about this second plane that was to have collected Australians and take them back, but it's got engine trouble, I think, and is being grounded at the moment at Frankfurt Airport. What do you know about that?

KEVIN RUDD: My understanding, based on my last report on this matter, is that the aircraft is due to arrive some time tomorrow morning Cairo time, because there have been some problems with it. That is why the largest group of Australians have been located at the airport in a hotel provided by us with embassy officials there to move them straight to the aircraft as it arrives.

As for other Australians who I mentioned before who are located in the middle of town with our embassy staff, of course, we'll make further arrangements to make sure that they have safe exit arrangements for the country as well. We are working through this systemically here in Munich at the security conference I'm attending. I'm also working with - to the course of tomorrow with foreign ministers from around Europe on this very question, given that tomorrow is a very difficult day in terms of the overall political situation in Egypt.

VIRGINIA TRIOLI: Oh yes, and around the region as well, a day of rage planned in so many cities. Just finally, Minister Rudd, if I could just change subjects. Of course, your home state of Queensland - far north Queensland - has been battered by Cyclone Yasi. Any particular reports you're hearing about people that you hold near and dear in far north Queensland?

KEVIN RUDD: Yeah, we've been following this closely as well. I mean, Queensland's taken a huge battering again, and Tully, Cardwell, Mission Beach, I mean, these are towns I know very well. Been to them many times over the years.

The stunning thing here in Europe is that people scratch their head and ask how we could possibly cop it again like this. So, we're just relieved that there has not been - based on what we know, a huge loss of life. I know that there are still some checks to be done as I'm advised. But Therese and I, just as Queenslanders, just feel for everybody, although at a different end of the state, who have copped another kick in the guts.

VIRGINIA TRIOLI: Kevin Rudd, thanks for coming out into the cold for us and good to talk to you, thanks so much.

KEVIN RUDD: Thanks for having me on the program.

END

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