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MS DE ANGELIS: You’re here for the 2010 IISS Manama dialogue. I guess I’d like to ask: what the highest priority is for this year’s meeting agenda?

MR RUDD: Well I believe if you look at the challenges of regional security, and for that matter global security, we still have to come to terms with the great challenge that is Iran and their nuclear program. It overshadows everything. It doesn’t matter which of the Gulf States or others you speak to; this is a strong and dominant factor. It hasn’t gone away. And Iran, of course, continues to act in violation of its international obligations. I imagine that will be number one. Of course the continuation of the Middle East peace process is equally important for the long term and of course there will be discussion of that as well.

MS DE ANGELIS: Well I want to touch on both of those points but specifically on Iran: next week the P5+1 talks will be held in Geneva, and I know that Hilary Clinton has tried to facilitate the dialogue. How does a conference like this help push that forward?

MR RUDD: Well many of the principals directly or indirectly associated with P5+1 will be here, or at least their governments will be here. Secretary Clinton has been very active on this; she is entirely seized of the significance of the challenge that Iran represents. So I think you have often at the sides of such gatherings as this, the opportunity to push the agenda forward. Of course, the substantive question lies with the reaction of Tehran, and Tehran rising to the challenge of its international obligations and to comply with basic International Atomic Energy Agency standards. It’s a difficult process, it’s a fraught process but the US, I believe, is showing appropriate and strong regional leadership on this question.

MS DE ANGELIS: And what do you say to critics of these kinds of meetings, for example you know we didn’t necessarily see the results we were hoping for out of the G20; you have the Manama dialogue and the talks in Geneva. What do you say to the critics who say “it’s great that all these people get together and have these conversations but nothing really results”?

MR RUDD: Well let me give you one example: for example, I’ve just come from Kazakhstan. At Astana there was a gathering of some 75 delegations around the world for the Organisation of Security Cooperation Europe. That body has been going since 1975 or thereabouts, the Helsinki Final Act, the Helsinki Accords. And if you were to ask to point to a single dramatic outcome of that organisation’s existence, you would be hard pressed. But let me say the culture and the habits of cooperation which that gathering, over many years, has inculcated in member states is, of itself, of considerable value because it creates a culture and a habit of peacefully discussing long-standing territorial disputes, rather than resorting to, shall I say, more dramatic and destabilising means. The other international gatherings all speak for themselves but I think it is wrong to expect any single international gathering to produce a dramatic outcome. The alternative of not meeting is a resort to nation-state unilateralism of decades and centuries past. I think history tells us where that leads.

MS DE ANGELIS: That’s a good point. I want to switch gears for a moment and talk about Julian Assange, the founder of WikiLeaks. Obviously an Australian national. Would your Government prosecute Assange if the leaks were, if Aussie documents were leaked?

MR RUDD: Well the first thing is, of course, the Australian Government, together with all Governments, condemn the unauthorised release of confidential diplomatic communications. This is a fundamental disservice to the business of diplomacy. The reason why diplomacy occurs in secret is because you are dealing with complex problems for which there is no alternative means of communication. And this fundamentally assaults that system worldwide. Secondly, in terms of the individual that you’ve mentioned – Mr Assange – we in Australia, through the Australian Attorney-General, are investigating all avenues available to us through Australian law to see if any Australian laws have been violated in the conduct which Mr Assange has engaged in. On top of that, of course, we’re working with other governments in terms of our international legal obligations one-to-another to assist as well. We are seized of this; we are working cooperatively with other Governments because the principles at stake here are important.

MS DE ANGELIS: Would you consider this, I mean, is this treason?

MR RUDD: Well, Australian law is very careful on its definition of all these things. We, like the United States, are a country of laws. Now we adhere therefore to legal process. The Attorney-General has indicated the Australian Federal Police is investigating whether any breaches of the Australian criminal law have occurred, and if so whether a reference should be made to the Department of Public Prosecutions. That’s our legal process; it is independent and arms length of political considerations, as it should be in a nation of laws.

MS DE ANGELIS: What’s your stance on North Korea’s attack of South Korea, and do you feel that China, you know, is taking...or doing enough to try to help mitigate the situation?

MR RUDD: Well Australia stands rock solid behind the Republic of Korea. We were with our friends in the South in the Korean War, 1950-1953, when deep and fundamental principles were at stake. These unprovoked attacks by North Korea on the South are frankly unacceptable in the extreme. It’s not just this most recent artillery barrage against a South Korean island; that’s bad enough in itself. But it represents a triptych of what’s happened over the last six months: the sinking of the Cheonan, the death of nearly 50 South Korean sailors as a result of an unprovoked attack by the North Koreans. And then, on top of that again, the revelations of a week or two ago about North Korea’s heavy uranium enrichment program. This, taken on top of those two earlier events, represents unprecedented provocations against the South. Of course we urge restraint all round. The South Koreans have demonstrated that so far.

You ask therefore, is diplomacy doing enough and particularly that of China. We, together with all countries believe that it is important that diplomacy is used to try and bring this situation back to normality, and we would call upon our friends in Beijing to do more than is currently occurring. I understand full well, as someone who has visited Pyongyang on a number of occasions and who spends quite a bit of time in Beijing, that it is wrong to assume that North Korea will simply do that which China tells it to do. It’s not that sort of relationship. Nonetheless China does have influence in the North, and I believe because North Korea’s actions represent such an assault, not just on international norms, but on the peace, stability and therefore prosperity of North East Asia and wider East Asia, that it is imperative that we all do more. That includes our friends in Beijing.

MS DE ANGELIS: I’m going to transition to a little bit of a lighter note and talk about the disappointment over the failed FIFA World Cup bid.

MR RUDD: Well, you win some you lose some. We Australians always believe in having a go and we’ve done so, but we didn’t prevail. So congratulations to Qatar for prevailing. I’m sure that they will conduct a first class event. This is of course good for the Arab world, it’s good for the Islamic world, and I think these are good things in themselves. So, in the great Australian tradition of good sportsmanship we congratulate those who have won and we will try and participate constructively in making sure this is a first class event, but back home folks are a bit downcast as you’d expect. Like many countries around the world, we are a little bit sports mad so this has been disappointing.

MS DE ANGELIS: Now some analysts are saying that you know you might have lost the bid for the World Cup but that Australia is actually very, very strong in its production of Liquefied Natural Gas and actually might overtake Qatar in the next decade. Can you comment on that at all?

MR RUDD: So... football to...

MS DE ANGELIS: to natural gas.

MR RUDD: Ok, that is what I would call the segue of the century. Nicely done. Well let’s just leave football there for a minute. Look in terms of LNG and energy at large I suppose Australia counts for something of an energy superpower in the sense that we supply so many of the energy needs of the world, whether it’s in terms of coal, where we are the world’s largest coal exporter; or now LNG, where I think we come in at number five worldwide. Yes, we have many untapped reserves and resources around Australia and not just off the North West Shelf but elsewhere as well. The key thing though for the supply of LNG and any fundamental energy resource is to provide customers around the world with guarantees of long-term stable supply. Australia is a stable democracy. We’ve been supplying the energy and resource needs of our friends in Japan, Korea, China, India and other parts of the world for decades upon decades upon decades, and then when it comes to LNG we would seek to do the same. We’ve signed already some very large contracts around the world. We’ll continue to do so. Of course, always subject to commercial considerations and price.

MS DE ANGELIS: Now recent growth in Australia is... has been a little bit slower than expected. A little bit muted. So what is the government doing to help work opportunities and to move forward in 2011 a little bit stronger?

MR RUDD: Well can I just put that into a little bit of context. Australia is I think the only major advanced economy not to have gone into recession through the Global Financial Crisis. We remained in positive growth. That occurred because the government engaged in a timely, targeted, temporary fiscal stimulus strategy which the IMF has judged to be one of the most effective of anywhere in the world – and the World Bank as well. Therefore, because of those actions we’ve remained positive. Our unemployment rate is barely over five per cent which, given what is happening in North America and Western Europe, is a pretty reasonable number. So when you say “can we do more?” well, yeah there is always more to be done. But for us it hinges on a number of factors around the world. Let’s for example; get Doha done, let’s get a free trade agreement so that all of our economies can benefit from a global boost to activity, growth and jobs which comes off the back of free trade. We are in the Gulf at the moment. Doha is not far away from where we are but can I say it is still a fair way away from realisation. This requires political will. Getting that right, and maintaining the stability of the global financial system, which still faces significant challenges, and broadly global macro-economic stability. If we prevail on these big externals, then I believe Australia’s policy settings will continue to benefit the growth and employment prospects of our own economy. In Asia we are the fourth largest economy. Worldwide we come in at number twelve or number thirteen. We are only a country of 22 million people, but we don’t rest on our laurels. There is still much more to do.

MS DE ANGELIS: Of course. Speaking on a global scale there have been some positive data points out from China, Europe and the US; speculation that the crisis in the Euro-zone might be waning a little bit, so we’ve seen a rally worldwide. Do you think that the rally has legs?

MR RUDD: Well, I have been around since the beginning of this crisis in Australian political office, either as Prime Minister or as Foreign Minister, so I’ve seen lots of data points over a long period of time. And as the Great Bard once said one swallow doth not a summer make. So let us just be patient and work our way through the data. I don’t believe it’s a time for ecstasy or celebration, nor do I believe it is a time for gloom and despair. Sometimes markets think it is either A or B. C is grinding, continuing reality. I think that’s what we’ve got. I believe our friends in Europe are rising to the challenge that they’ve got. The necessary actions they’ve taken in Greece and Ireland. Careful management will be required of course in relation to Portugal. But if we can handle those things well in Europe and we get our global macro-economic settings right vis-a-vis outstanding currency questions with China, vis-a-vis people restoring their national fiscal houses to order and to balance over a reasonable period of time; that I believe is in all of our collective interests.

Nation states are working their way through so I don’t believe it’s cause for people to go out there and believe the job is done. Nor do I believe it is cause for people, having picked up their morning newspaper, that the end is nigh. It’s a much more complex business than that.