Interview on Radio National Breakfast
Topics: John Faulkner, asylum seeker regional solution
Transcript, proof E&OE
8 July 2010
GERALDINE DOOGUE: Before we get to some of those bigger discussions, and your work in PNG, could I ask you how big a loss you assess it'll be for Cabinet to lose a minister of the calibre of John Faulkner?
STEPHEN SMITH: Oh, John will be a loss, there's no doubt about that. From a personal point of view, he's been a good friend and a good colleague for a long time. We've been on the campaign trail together during election campaigns, we've sat round campaign committees, and more importantly Cabinet meetings together, but I know him well, and I know that this is something that he's been contemplating for some time.
GERALDINE DOOGUE: So you knew this was coming, did you?
STEPHEN SMITH: Well, I've had conversations with John in the past, where it's quite clear that John has continued to perform roles for us out of his duty, his obligation and his adherence to conducting himself honourably, rather than doing that which he would personally prefer...
GERALDINE DOOGUE: Has he lost the fire in the belly?
STEPHEN SMITH: I don't think John will ever lose the fire in the belly, but you know, he's come to the decision that it's time to move on. I'm very pleased that he will stay around as a Senator, being able to give good advice, to mentor and help young Members and Senators, and also give sensible advice to his colleagues. Of course he'll be a loss, of course we'll miss him, but from my perspective, it's no surprise.
GERALDINE DOOGUE: To asylum seekers now, 10 years ago, your predecessor, Alexander Downer tried to establish a processing centre in East Timor, and their Government said no to him then, why will they say yes to you now?
STEPHEN SMITH: Well, East Timor's response of course will be a matter for East Timor, but one of the reasons that 10 years ago there was a negative response was because it wasn't done under the auspices of the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees. It wasn't done as a genuine effort to get a regional solution to a regional and global problem. It was essentially done unilaterally and bilaterally. We've made the point, the Prime Minister's made the point, we are trying to seek a regional solution here. She's had a conversation with President Ramos Horta of East Timor, she's had a conversation with the Prime Minister of...
GERALDINE DOOGUE: She has had a conversation with Ramos Horta, sorry, she hasn't with Gusmao though yet, has she?
STEPHEN SMITH: Well, I'll come to that, but I'll finish this point. She's had a conversation with the Prime Minister of New Zealand – and New Zealand of course is relevant because like Australia it's a resettlement country – to make the point that she wants to pursue seriously throughout the region, a notion of a regional processing centre, which would involve transit countries, destination countries, and also resettlement countries.
And that's the only way in which we'll get a viable regional effective solution, by doing it in that way, either under the auspices of the so-called Bali Process, which is the regional institution dealing with people-smuggling and human trafficking and people movement matters, or generally through a regional conversation.
GERALDINE DOOGUE: But as we said, she's yet to speak to Xanana Gusmao, and if a foreign country publicly announced plans to do something similar on Australian soil, having spoken only to the Governor-General, not the Government, I don't think you'd be happy as a Foreign Minister, to hear that.
STEPHEN SMITH: Well, I know this point's being made in Australia, but frankly it's a point that's being made in Australia much more ferociously than it is in East Timor. President Ramos Horta is more than just a Head of State, that's quite clear from the way in which he operates and the way in which he works closely in conjunction with Prime Minister Gusmao. And there's nothing inappropriate with Prime Minister Gillard having that conversation with the President.
This point I think is also sort of under-appreciated, she's made crystal clear that we are at the very beginning of a conversation. I'm in Papua New Guinea now, when I return to Australia, I'll have a conversation with my East Timorese counterpart, Zacarias da Costa, as I will with a number of my other colleagues throughout the region, to try and get regional support.
Now in the end, what East Timor decides, in terms of whether it wants to take part, will be a matter for the Government of East Timor. Every time you have a conversation about the emotional and sensitive and difficult issue of human trafficking, people smuggling, boat people, people movements, refugees, there are always different views, often expressed emotionally, often expressed on the run. It's no surprise to me that there might be different views expressed in East Timor, just as there'll be different views expressed in Australia, just as there'll be different views expressed throughout the region.
What we're trying to do is to get regional support for what would be an effective regional contribution to a very difficult problem, which not just our region suffers from, but the whole world, because of massive movements of people.
GERALDINE DOOGUE: But in that John Curtin lecture that you delivered in Perth this week, you talked about a strong and enhanced engagement in the Asia Pacific, and obviously this is very much in your remit, that there has to - appearances matter here, don't they, and appearances of sort of legitimacy, and doing things in an orderly way, so that there are no shocks? Now it doesn't feel like this, at the moment.
STEPHEN SMITH: Well, we are doing things in an orderly way. If we weren't doing things in an orderly way, then we would have announced something unilaterally and bilaterally.
A range of people and countries were alerted to the Prime Minister's speech in advance of its delivery, that's the first point. Secondly, immediately upon delivery, all of the usual diplomatic efforts were then made to ensure that people throughout our region, governments throughout our region, were aware of the suggestion, aware of the proposal.
I also make this point, this is the first time that we've seen a leader in our region take this issue up in the manner in which the Prime Minister has, wanting to try and get an outcome, but it's not as if this hasn't been the subject of some conversation in the past, either at officials' level through the Bali Process, or more generally.
There have been suggestions, or notions in the past, but it's the first time we've had someone say this is something that we should take up – the Prime Minister has taken the lead on it.
As she has said, this is the very early stages, but she wants to do it in the way which you have outlined, in a sensible, orderly process, and to discuss that throughout the region.
It's not going to occur overnight, unlike some people, like Tony Abbott, who somehow suggest to the Australian public there's a magic instant solution, or who massively overstate the case in frankly an outrageous way, which you've played from him this morning.
GERALDINE DOOGUE: So you're really saying to the - you think your argument to the Australian people will be, we have started something, which will lead to something, that's really what you're going to be saying?
STEPHEN SMITH: Well, the argument is this. We have made, since we came to office, substantial efforts to enhance the capacity to protect and manage our borders, that's the first thing. Secondly, we are facing a very difficult problem of large numbers of people moving in our direction, conflict in Sri Lanka, more importantly and more largely, conflict in Afghanistan, and that is seeing large numbers of people movements.
A small number come to Australia, but they do come to Australia, and they come on boats, which we want to avoid. And the only way we can stop that occurring is by working closely with countries in that region.
We've been working very closely with Indonesia, with Malaysia, Thailand, Sri Lanka, other countries, and we've increased the assistance and the support that we can give to their agencies in the course of this week.
But there's no instant or magic solution here. It requires working carefully and closely, but we're not going to solve this problem overnight.
Any suggestion by Tony Abbott that you can somehow magically do that, or turn back the boats to Indonesia, which won't accept them, is just trying to trick the Australian public into believing that somehow this problem, which the whole world faces, can be solved overnight.
GERALDINE DOOGUE: Thank you very much indeed for joining us, Stephen Smith.
STEPHEN SMITH: Thanks, Geraldine.
GERALDINE DOOGUE: Stephen Smith, the Foreign Minister, speaking to us from PNG.
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