Transcript, E&OE
12 November 2009
Interview - Australia Network, Newshour with Jim Middleton
Topics: Asylum seekers, APEC, regional architecture
JIM MIDDLETON: It's nearly a month since the Australian customs ship, the Oceanic Viking, picked up 78 Sri Lankan asylum seekers in Indonesia's search and rescue zone. Since then, the ship's been languishing in Indonesian waters with the asylum seekers demanding to be brought to Australia. Australia's latest offer is to resettle the Sri Lankans swiftly as soon as they set foot on Indonesian soil. Australia's Foreign Minister Stephen Smith is in Singapore for meetings leading up to the APEC Summit and has also been using the opportunity for talks with his Indonesian counterpart Marty Natalegawa to try to end the impasse.
Foreign Minister, thanks you for your time.
STEPHEN SMITH: Pleasure, Jim.
JIM MIDDLETON: The Australian Opposition says that the offer to the Sri Lankans is simply an open invitation for more Sri Lankans to head to Australia. They do have a point, don't they?
STEPHEN SMITH: I don't believe that's the case at all. It's important, I think, to remember where the Oceanic Viking matter started. It started as a search and rescue operation in Indonesia's search and rescue area, and at the request of Indonesian authorities, we rescued them and, following an agreement with Indonesia, we took them to Indonesia.
The people on board include people who have already been assessed as refugees. Other people who want to claim asylum and if they are assessed as refugees, then in accordance with the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees processes in Indonesia, they'll be resettled. Australia is one of the resettlement countries, as is New Zealand, as is Canada, United States, and some European countries.
This is something which has occurred for a number of years including when the current Opposition were in government. So resettlement to Australia from Indonesia is something which has occurred in the past. It will occur in the future.
JIM MIDDLETON: Prime Minister Kevin Rudd has insisted throughout this saga that there would be no special deals for the Sri Lankans but this latest offer to those on the Oceanic Viking is just that.
STEPHEN SMITH: Again I don't agree with that characterisation. There are people on board the boat who have already been assessed as refugees by the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees. In the normal course of events, they will fall for resettlement. That will occur, and we've given an indication as to the time lines and the timetables on which we believe that can be done.
There are other people who, if they are assessed as refugees, will also be resettled and we've given indications as to the time lines in respect of which we believe that can done.
I think there's another important point here. It seems to me that if an asylum seeker is assessed as a refugee, then we should do everything we can to settle, or resettle, those people as quickly as we can.
JIM MIDDLETON: You've had the chance to speak to Indonesian Foreign Minister Marty Natalegawa while you're in Singapore. You mentioned a moment ago that Australia had an agreement with Indonesia, in fact, nearly a month ago now. You must be frustrated that it's not turned out as simply as you might have hoped 25, 26 days ago?
STEPHEN SMITH: I had a very good meeting here with Indonesian Foreign Minister, Marty Natalegawa. We had a good meeting the other night. And as we should, we started with the strength of the relationship and what more we can do in the future to broaden and deepen that. The general relationship has never been better.
Of course, we also spoke about this difficult issue. Neither of us are frustrated because we both have an abundance of patience, as we've both said previously.
Of course it's difficult…
JIM MIDDLETON: You say you have an abundance of patience, Minister Natalegawa says that too, but others within the Foreign Ministry in Jakarta say that Indonesia does not have indefinite patience, that's a very different message.
STEPHEN SMITH: Well, when I listen to the Indonesian foreign policy position, I listen to the Foreign Minister. And he and I are not frustrated, because we have an abundance of patience.
Of course, it's difficult. These are complex discussions, complex negotiations dealing with the people on the boat, and dealing with arrangements between Australian and Indonesian officials.
No-one's suggesting that our preference would not have been for this to have ended earlier. But we will take it calmly, methodically, step by step to complete our objective. And we're doing that in close cooperation with Indonesia.
Yes, I've spoken to Marty about these matters on more than one occasion. But in very many respects the most important discussions are those which are occurring on the boat between Australian officials and the people on the boat, but also between Australian officials and Indonesian officials on the ground, both in Jakarta and Tanjung Pinang.
JIM MIDDLETON: I will just turn briefly to one other question which is APEC, the reason you're in Singapore. Do you get the sense from your discussions with your counterparts that there is increasing interest in the notion first promoted by Kevin Rudd more an year ago in some form of a more authoritative economic and security structure encompassing the Asia Pacific?
STEPHEN SMITH: Well, I certainly think there's much more interest in having a conversation about how the regional architecture should look in the course of the next 10 or 15 years as a consequence of this being the era or the century of the Asia Pacific, as economic and strategic and political influence moves to our part of the world - the rise of China, the rise of India, the rise of the ASEAN economies combined, the ongoing significant importance and influence of the United States.
So, I think there's now more of an appetite for a discussion. I think, also, that new Japanese Prime Minister Hatoyama's East Asia proposal has also caused people to come to the conclusion that this the time to have the conversation, to have the consideration. And we're very much looking forward to our track-and-a-half dialogue conference in Sydney in December.
I think there's also another element and that's this: the G20 has now been consolidated as the international economic institution. And if you look, for example, at the G20 and APEC overlap, we've got over 20 economies in APEC, nearly half are G20 members, nine members of the G20 in APEC.
So, I think there's a mood or a view emerging that the time's also come to look at that. Yes, there may be a proliferation of institutions, there may be overlap, and there may be some disparate efforts. But how can we get the architecture right and also how can we use these various, very important forums to build consensus or momentum for good policy outcomes.
There's an overlap between the East Asia Summit and the ASEAN Regional Forum with APEC. There's an overlap between the G20 and APEC.
And there's now a discussion which Foreign Ministers had in the course of our deliberations here, about: can we use these crossovers, these overlaps to start encouraging momentum, build momentum or build consensus for important ideas in a raft of international areas of challenge including, in my view, general peace and security issues.
JIM MIDDLETON: Foreign Minister, thanks for joining us.
STEPHEN SMITH: Thanks, Jim. Thank you very much.
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