Transcript E&OE
1 November 2009
Interview - Laurie Oakes, Today on Sunday
Subjects: Recent government appointments and action on asylum seekers.
LAURIE OAKES: Mr Smith, welcome to the program.
STEPHEN SMITH: Good morning, Laurie.
LAURIE OAKES: As predicted, Kevin Rudd's rewarded another Liberal. He's given Peter Costello a job as a member of the Future Fund Board of Guardians.
Why is Mr Costello uniquely qualified for that job?
STEPHEN SMITH: Well, he was Treasurer for over a decade. The requirements and the duties of the governors of the Future Fund are set out, they're well established and you can't be Treasurer of the Commonwealth for ten years and not pick up the knowledge that you need. But also, no one's ever disputed that Mr Costello is a person of abilities. So, the appointment's made on merit. We think it's a good one and we think he'll make a contribution.
We don't disqualify people just because they happen at some stage to have been political opponents.
LAURIE OAKES: But the Labor Party spent 12 years, near enough, bagging Peter Costello as Treasurer. They said he indeed failed to properly spend the money from the boom. They said he ignored warning after warning from the Reserve Bank about inflation. They said, basically, he was hopeless.
Yet, now he's a genius and we need to give him this job.
STEPHEN SMITH: We had our criticisms of the Howard/Costello Government's economic policies. But I don't think people dispute the fact that Peter Costello does have ability and he's got relevant experience. So we believe that on merit it's a decent appointment.
LAURIE OAKES: Well, he's hopeless one minute, he's a decent appointment the next. Doesn't this expose the hypocrisy of politics and politicians?
STEPHEN SMITH: What it does do and what it shows, I think Laurie, is it is possible after someone completes their time in Parliament or in a Government, that you can look at these things objectively and dispassionately and it's not inappropriate for someone who does have ability to serve.
This is a national interest job. I don't think anyone has ever doubted, irrespective of differences of policy or politics, that people like Mr Costello, or for example, Mr Nelson, or indeed Mr Beazley, won't put the national interest first when they're asked to do these jobs after their time as Ministers and in the Parliament.
So, we think he'll make a contribution and we think he'll serve that and play that national interest task.
LAURIE OAKES: Well, you mentioned Kim Beazley's going to Washington. Apart from him, all the jobs for the boys have gone to people in the Coalition side. You're aware, aren't you, of growing resentment in the ALP about that?
STEPHEN SMITH: Kim Beazley was a very fine appointment. And the Prime Minister's made it clear that, irrespective of past Parliamentary or Government service, that won't disqualify you. The Prime Minister, quite rightly, wants to make appointments on merit. He wants to find the best people for the best particular jobs. We believe that Mr Nelson...
LAURIE OAKES: So all the best people are on the Coalition side?
STEPHEN SMITH: No, it's a matter of horses for courses, Laurie. It's a matter of the best people for particular jobs.
Mr Nelson was very appropriately suited to the Brussels job because of his experience as a Defence Minister and the importance of NATO to that job. So, it doesn't mean that just because you happen to be a former Member of Parliament that you get special treatment, nor does it mean that you're disqualified.
We like to make these appointments, and we do make these appointments, on merit and we try and make sure that the person appointed is the best available person for the job. That applies irrespective of politics.
LAURIE OAKES: And there's no resentment in the Labor Party about that?
STEPHEN SMITH: Well, there are always views in the Labor Party about who should be appointed where. One thing I am absolutely sure of is that there was rejoicing in the Labor Party at Kim Beazley's appointment because that was seen to be a most appropriate appointment.
LAURIE OAKES: A one off.
STEPHEN SMITH: I wouldn't describe it in that way. It's, in very many respects, one of our most important diplomatic appointments. He was uniquely qualified for that job and the best person available and that's why we appointed him.
LAURIE OAKES: Well, I won't embarrass you any more over this. So, we'll move onto asylum seekers. Do you expect the Government to take a hit in the opinion polls over the asylum seeker issue? And how big a hit?
STEPHEN SMITH: I think we've seen in the media almost constant attention on this issue for two or three weeks. So in very many respects that'll be seen as a distraction from some of the issues that the public want to see us dealing with: the economy, their own lives, and their own circumstances.
So, I won't be surprised. I don't believe that in the long-term it'll be a structural or a long-term difficulty for us. And that's because we've been dealing with a very difficult and complex matter in a calm and assured way.
We know that there are very grave difficulties that we face with the push factors, pushing displaced people our way. Not just from Afghanistan and Pakistan, but also, more recently, from Sri Lanka. But we're dealing with it, you know, in a calm, assured, and methodical way. In the end I'm confident that that will come through and that will ring true so far as the community's concerned.
LAURIE OAKES: Is it true that most of the people picked up by the Oceanic Viking are already classified refugees who've been living in Indonesian camps for up to five years? Is that right?
STEPHEN SMITH: As always in these things, I believe it's best not to rush to judgement and not to assume facts that we might see in media or other reports. The best way of ascertaining that is for the 78 Sri Lankan asylum seekers to go off the boat and to be assessed by the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees in Indonesia. That's the best organisation, the UNHCR, qualified to assist in making these judgements.
So, that may or may not be the case. That's best determined by the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees. It's another reason, another argument if you like, why the asylum seekers on board should follow the advice they've been receiving from our officers on the Oceanic Viking and that is to calmly and peacefully and peaceably walk off the ship and allow that processing, that consideration to start.
LAURIE OAKES: Is it true that you spoke to the Indonesian Foreign Minister late last week about this? And, if so, with what result?
STEPHEN SMITH: Yes, I spoke to my counterpart, the new Indonesian Foreign Minister. We spoke at the end of last week. I firstly congratulated him on his appointment. I know Marty. I know him quite well and it's a very good appointment.
We spoke about the general strength of the relationship between Australia and Indonesia; about our cooperation now and into the future on these difficult matters and we also spoke about the Oceanic Viking issue.
And he and I both share the view that we have to be calm and patient and it's a very difficult situation but we believe we can work our way through it. Our conversation and our cooperation reflects the ongoing cooperation between Australia and Indonesia and our officials on this difficult matter.
But, he and I, once this issue is resolved, both want to look to the future, both want to look to the strength of our relationship. We both share the view that the relationship's never been better but we believe there's more that we can do across the broad range of our bilateral interests.
LAURIE OAKES: And in the meantime, while this stalemate goes on, these people are bobbing around the ocean on board the Oceanic Viking, the Government looks helpless. Helpless is not a good look is it?
STEPHEN SMITH: I wouldn't characterise it, or categorise it in that way. The Prime Minister, the Immigration Minister and I have all been quite upfront that this is a difficult circumstance. That we're working our way through it calmly. We believe that that's the best approach. We're doing that in cooperation with Indonesia, including my conversation with their Foreign Minister.
We're putting additional people to assist on the boat. There's been a crew change over. So, we're working our way through this and we are hopeful that, in the forthcoming period, we can get a positive outcome.
But just like Indonesia, we're not setting a deadline on it, we're not setting a timetable on it. It's difficult, it's complex, but we're doing it in a calm and methodical way.
LAURIE OAKES: The Immigration Minister has announced that he's radically expanding the Christmas Island detention centre. That looks like an admission of failure, an admission that we're going to see a continuation of an influx of boats.
STEPHEN SMITH: We certainly worry that we will see a continuation of an influx of boats. That's a point that Minister Evans and I have made in the past and not just in the recent past. We know that with additional conflict in our region, particularly Sri Lanka, but also heightened conflict in Afghanistan, that the push factors to send displaced people our way are there.
We know that mandatory detention in the first instance is important. Assessing people at Christmas Island gives us the opportunity of assessing them not just for refugee status, but for health and quarantine and security status. That's very important.
And the expansion of Christmas Island, as the Minister pointed out overnight, is the most effective way of ensuring that we can do this process in a way which protects Australia's borders. Also protects our national interest, but also enables asylum seekers to be assessed in accordance with our international obligations, which is what we should do.
LAURIE OAKES: Like the Prime Minister, you've talked about push factors from Sri Lanka, the way the Tamils are treated there. Kevin Rudd's talked several times about the asylum seeker issue to the President of Indonesia. Why hasn't he picked up the phone to the President of Sri Lanka?
STEPHEN SMITH: I've spoken to the President of Sri Lanka. I've also spoken to my counterpart on a number of occasions, Foreign Minister Bogollagama, and our officials have been in regular contact on two fronts.
Firstly on people smuggling or human trafficking issues but also on Australia's view that the international community needs to be assisting Sri Lanka, getting people out of the displaced people's camps after the civil war. The Sri Lankan Government having won the war, they now need to win the peace.
That's why Australia's made a substantial humanitarian contribution to help with the resettlement of displaced people, while we've urged the Government of Sri Lanka to sit down, with all of the political players in Sri Lanka, and come to a political compact, which may well require some aspects of semi-autonomy in the Tamil areas. And I've put that view to my counterpart and I've put those views to the President of Sri Lanka, just as other members of the international community have.
LAURIE OAKES: With due respect, though, if the Prime Minister picked up the phone, it would carry a lot more weight than the Foreign Minister doing it. Why won't Kevin Rudd talk to the President of Sri Lanka when he's picking up the phone to all sorts of other leaders?
And I know that there's been discussion in his department about the possibility of him visiting Sri Lanka. Why doesn't he go there and talk tough?
STEPHEN SMITH: It's not a matter of talking tough, it's a matter of talking sensibly. There's the prospect, for example, that Prime Minister Rudd and the President of Sri Lanka will have a conversation at the Commonwealth Heads of Government meeting, when CHOGM meets in Trinidad and Tobago in the middle of next month.
I've also made it clear to my counterpart that I'm proposing, if scheduling works, to go to Sri Lanka in the first half of next year, to have these discussions with the Sri Lankan Government. But also hopefully to look at some of the areas where displaced people have been resettled.
So, we have been working on this. Our officials in Sri Lanka, from our High Commissioner down have also been in ongoing discussion with Sri Lanka.
I actually believe, Laurie, that Australia is well placed to put these views to Sri Lanka. We're both Commonwealth members, as I've indicated. We've got a large Sri Lankan community in Australia, and we've worked very closely with them on difficult issues over the years. When there's a need, to use your phrase, to talk tough, we say that to them both privately and publicly.
But, the points we've been making, we believe are the valid points: assistance to the Government on resettling people, and getting them out of the camps. But also, there's got to be a political rapprochement, a political settlement in Sri Lanka.
The most important thing in our view, is that the Government now has to sit down with other political parties in Sri Lanka and win the peace, not just win the war.
LAURIE OAKES: Minister, we thank you.
STEPHEN SMITH: Thanks, Laurie. Thanks very much.
[END]
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