Transcript E&OE
13 October 2009
Interview with Ms Maya Mirchandani, NDTV Cable news channel
Subjects: Commonwealth Games; Australian cricket tour; Indian students in Australia; energy sales to India.
Journalist: Sir, thank you so much for giving us some of your time this evening. I want to start by asking you the question that is on every Indian's mind right now which is about security both for the Commonwealth Games which is high on your agenda in talks as well as for the Australian cricket team. Is that something you have raised in your discussions today?
Stephen Smith: In my talks today with External Affairs Minister Krishna, we talked about the Commonwealth Games. We certainly want the Commonwealth Games to be a success and I am confident it will be. That will be a great thing for India, a great thing for the Commonwealth and a great thing for Australia because we are sending the largest ever overseas sporting team.
We also had a conversation about security. We are very confident with the security arrangements. We are very pleased that we are being consulted as are other Commonwealth countries. I also indicated that we have had a recent experience ourselves in the Melbourne Commonwealth Games. We are very happy to extend help to India in whatever form with our experience. But we are very happy with the consultations and we are very pleased with the planning arrangements.
So far as cricket is concerned, I took the opportunity of going down and spending a bit of time with the New South Wales Blues who are, of course, here for the Twenty20 Competition and we hope they are doing well so far. But the Australian Government is in close contact with the Australian Cricket Board on security measures. There was a time that people thought that may be cricketers were immune from acts of terrorism until the terrible attack upon the Sri Lankan cricket team that took place in Pakistan. So we give the Australian Cricket Board every assistance in these matters and we work closely with the Indian authorities in that respect as well.
Journalist: So when you say you work closely with the Indian authorities in that respect, could that be in the way of also sending your own security team along with the players?
Stephen Smith: Not so much Australian Government's security team, but we work closely with the Australian Cricket Board and through the Australian Cricket Board, with the various State Cricket bodies like the New South Wales Cricket Association. They make their own arrangements so far as their tour is concerned, and we make available to them all the information, advise, expertise and assessments that we have. It has to be a matter for Cricket Australia or for our own cricket teams to make their own judgments. We give them the advice that we have to make about the public and we help them as much as we can.
Journalist: And your advice at this time where we are right now, did not in any way suggest that they should pull out of their tour to India?
Stephen Smith: Well, our advice is there for all to see in the public travel advice that we have. It is there on our website for all to see. That is the advice we give to anyone who asks about travel.
Journalist: And that includes something…this is a symbolism of a visit…
Stephen Smith: With any organized sporting activity, particularly as large as the Commonwealth Games, obviously, the organizers, in this case, India, most recently, in our case, in Melbourne, one has to take special steps. In an ideal world, the last thing we have to worry about is something as magnificent as the Commonwealth Games in India will be the security and the threat where someone will try and cause damage to innocent athletes or innocent spectators. But regrettably that is the modern world.
So, when there is a large gathering of people, the risk is that it becomes a target for extremists. So, extra precautions are taken and that is why, India, quite sensibly, is working with other Commonwealth countries in the planning of its security arrangements.
Journalist: We had this Commonwealth Delegation this week end and it actually created quite a stir by saying that they are not happy with the situation as they see it now, given that there is a year to go until the Games. Is Australia concerned about this state of preparedness?
Stephen Smith: Well, those comments, as I understand, were made in respect of the preparation of some of the venues, some of the facilities. As I said, to Minister Krishna in the course of our conversations, every Olympic Games that I have seen, including the Sydney Olympic Games, every Commonwealth Games that I have seen, including the Melbourne Games, at some point we always have suggestions made that facilities might be ready in time or there is unevenness about preparations. On every occasion in the end, the Games come to a successful conclusion. So, we are absolutely confident that will be the case as well in Delhi and we are very much looking forward to attending that.
So, those comments by the Commonwealth Games organizers about facilities and the preparation of venues, these comments are always made. But in the end, Australia is confident of two things. Firstly, that India will put on a terrific set of games and secondly, the whole of security arrangements and precautions that have to be planned for are being planned for and that is being done in consultation not just with Australia alone but with all other Commonwealth countries.
Journalist: You also just now mentioned the sharing of expertise and experience really. I am talking about the Melbourne Games in 2006. Are there any lessons India has brought or talked about some kind of inputs that they may seek from Australia specifically?
Stephen Smith: Not specifically with me today through Minister Krishna. As you say, the Commonwealth Delegates have been in town this week, the relevant officers, including those responsible for security, they can speak on a regular basis…(inaudible)…Of course, it is not just the Melbourne Commonwealth Games, it is also the Sydney Olympics. It is just a sharing of experience which makes sense to the organizers of the Commonwealth Games or the Olympic Games, as the case may be. There is always something you can learn from someone's most recent experience.
Journalist: Sir, we move on to another topic which is of a lot of interest in India- the subject of Indian students in Australia. A number of senior representatives from Australia come in, come to Delhi, try and meet the Government, re-assure the public. I am sure you are planning visits with students as well. What is the latest on the state of investigations into some of the racial crimes that have taken place in Melbourne? What steps is the Government taking to ensure that that there is at least some sort of scaling back into these attacks?
Stephen Smith: There are a number of points. Firstly, our Deputy Prime Minister, Minister for Education had been here previously, our Minister for Immigration had been here previously and we are all saying the same thing which is these attacks are terrible, we do not regard these as being the norm for Australia. Australia continues to be a safe, tolerant and welcoming destination for Indian students and for students from other countries. So, we absolutely condemn the terrible acts that have occurred.
These, of course, are investigations for the police authorities to pursue. The relevant State police authorities are doing everything they can to bring the perpetrators of these terrible crimes to justice.
In the mean time, there are a range of things that we are doing to try and make sure that the prospects of any of these terrible events occurring again are minimized or eliminated and we are doing that in conjunction with the Indian High Commission in Australia and also in conjunction with the Government here.
We have also discovered that there are a range of aspects, immigration aspects and education aspects which, frankly, required improving, providing and giving more integrity. Thus ensuring better quality and those changes are being made in conjunction again with the Indian Government, the Indian authorities.
We have seen some very bad incidents, but we continue to want Indian students to come to Australia. We think that we can provide quality education and experience. The great thing about quality education and experience from a young student in a different country is when they return home they essentially become ambassadors of the country where they had their education. They, in our case, are ambassadors for Australia and that is the norm and the general experience so far as Indian students are concerned and we want that to continue.
Journalist: So, these attacks that have taken place primarily in one part of the country, what, in your assessment or in the Government's assessment, has been the reason for these localized kind of incidents?
Stephen Smith: As a general proposition and I speak only in general terms because a number of these measures, that I say, are the subject of Victorian Police in this case and we want to make sure that the perpetrators are brought to justice. We do not want to say anything publicly which might come in the way of that, but many of these incidents seem to occur when students are traveling late at night on public transport back to their homes.
Together with the Victorian Police authorities, a range of things occurred. Efforts were made to make sure there is much greater police presence on those streets at those times. Information was given to students to make sure that they are given advice about the safest and the best way of protecting themselves.
So, simple and basic crime prevention techniques were put in place. We, as I say, regard these terrible incidents as essentially isolated incidents and we are, together with the State authorities, doing our best to ensure that they do not happen again.
But if there was a common factor, it appeared to be students traveling late at night, returning home, are being exposed to risk. And we have moved to rectify that both with police operational procedure but also with the advice that students receive from their educational institutions and also from the police themselves.
Journalist: I think, partly the question I was trying to ask is, why Melbourne, why not any other part of Australia or are they just not as frequently reported in other parts of country?
Stephen Smith: Well, generally, Australia is a safe society. Generally most people in Australia, whether they are Australian citizens or residents from overseas with their children or with their students, spend all of their time in Australia in a peaceful way with none of these terrible instances occurring to them or come across. That is what we want to continue.
We want to leave it to the police investigations on individual cases to see whether there is any particular strand or cause or reasons as to why these have occurred. But in the sweep of things, when we look at all of the crimes, the statistics for Australia and elsewhere, we remain a safe community. But when these things occur, not only do we condemn it but we move together with the relevant authorities to do their best to ensure that it does not happen again.
Journalist: If the investigations do conclude that these were not random crimes committed for an i-pod or a laptop or muggings but there was a racial colour to them as India has been alleging, is there a more stringent set of punishments or legislations that Australia has that deal with racial attacks specifically?
Stephen Smith: Let us not get ahead of ourselves. Firstly, we need to wait till the police investigations have concluded and then we have to wait and to see the traces of the crimes.
Journalist: So, in general, is there a legislation for race attacks that is different from the legislation for the crimes perhaps?
Stephen Smith: It varies from State to State. The State I come from has express legislation which makes unlawful racially motivated attacks, but the criminal law of Australia is dealt with on a State-by-State basis, not by a common legislation. There are some jurisdictions in some States. In some Provinces there is express legislation which makes these arrangements relating to a particular crime.
Journalist: How long do the investigations generally go on?
Stephen Smith: It is just as the same in India. They are matters for Government Ministers to investigate or for Governments to investigate and that would be not just inappropriate, but it would be wrong for me to say. They are matters for the independent investigation by the police. What we want is a successful conclusion which is to bring the perpetrators to justice. So we do not put a time table. We just want to make sure that those investigations are effective.
Journalist: Do you feel that with all the interactions all these Australian leaders have been having in India with students, with the Government or meetings over there with Indian community leaders or students, as the case may be, has it helped calm some of the fears that exist over there?
Stephen Smith: I think that is right. I think there is an appreciation amongst the Indian Government, the Indian High Commission in Canberra, educational institutions both in Australia and in India that both our Governments are working very hard to minimize the prospects of this occurring again.
I think much more work has to be done on Australia's part to satisfy the concerns of the Indian public or Indian parents. I think that will take a longer period of time, but the most important thing in that respect is the Australian Government or Australia is acknowledging that some damage has been done to our reputation and we need to, over time, restore that and put it back to where it was.
I think there is a very keen appreciation on the part of the Government of India and its agencies that everything we can do has been done or is being done. I suspect it will take a longer period of time for confidence to grow amongst the Indian public generally and particularly amongst the parents who have sent or are thinking of sending their kids overseas for education.
Journalist: I was looking at your Joint Statement earlier on the framework dialogue and again, I know that still the student issue is one that may not find the kind of space over here, but I know it has been high on the agenda. What was interesting about is, this is also cooperation, you are talking about non-proliferation issues. I know that your Government has a position on uranium sales to India. Did that come up in your talks with S.M. Krishna?
Stephen Smith: There is potential rethinking for the provision of energy by Australia to India, whether coal or liquefied natural gas and the like. Yes, uranium came up but only in passing because the Australian position and the Indian position are of longstanding and are well-known.
I think, importantly also there is acknowledgement by both Governments that Australia worked very hard to help effect a consensus in the Nuclear Suppliers Group over the India-United States Civil Nuclear Agreement and, I think, that is appreciated and they will believe that was a good thing to do. But our position on uranium is well-known. India's position on the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty is also well-known and we respect each other's position. We also acknowledge that India would prefer we had a different policy approach. India also understands that Australia would prefer that India had a different policy approach on the NPT, but we treat this very much as business in passing. We do not dwell on it because our positions are well-known and respected.
Journalist: And mutually exclusive basically as well.
Stephen Smith: Well, often in any relationship, in any good relationship, which is what we have with India and which we want to enhance, there will always be things where we even take a different view or a different approach. The key thing is to make sure that it does not get in the way of the fundamentals of the relationship.
If India had to make a choice, if the people of India had to make a choice, they would have much preferred our support in building consensus in the Nuclear Suppliers Group than worrying about from where it sourced its uranium requirements.
India does not, for example, have a uranium supply shortage or difficulty and we believe it was a good thing for India to come on the side of the international community through the US-India Civil Nuclear Agreement and we were very pleased to work constructively in that respect.
Journalist: But there was a perception in spite of the support at the NSG that the Australian has shifted a little bit as well from the previous Government to the current Government on the issue of supply of uranium. Is that how your Government sees it as well?
Stephen Smith: The political party that I represent has a longstanding policy position of uranium exports and on the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty. That is not a view shared by our political opponents.
Journalist: That is the party position. It is not the Government's position. Has there been any legislation by the Parliament?
Stephen Smith: It just indicates that my party forms the Government just as a particular political party in India forms a Government.
Journalist: But in the case of something like this, if there is legislation, if there is a guideline, whether the Government is of one political party or the other, they have to follow it.
Stephen Smith: It is not a matter of legislation or a guideline. My political party has a longstanding policy position which is well-known to India about export of uranium and the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty. My political party was elected to the Government and that becomes the Government policy. It is not a matter of what previously existed.
Journalist: Or what could exist in the future as well, perhaps, in that case.
Stephen Smith: Well, as I say, India's policy position on the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty is well-known, Australia's policy position on uranium export is also well-known.
Journalist: Thanks a lot for sparing your valuable time.
Stephen Smith: Thanks.
[END]
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