Transcript, E&OE
11 August 2009
Interview - ABC Radio AM
Subjects: Australia - China relations.
LYNDAL CURTIS: Stephen Smith, there have been detail, more detail of allegations this week against the Rio Tinto executive Stern Hu and the company itself alleging years of spying in China. Do those allegations come as a surprise to you?
STEPHEN SMITH: I've read the opinion piece that was put up yesterday or over the weekend on the National Secrets Protection Bureau website, and frankly when I read it, it didn't contain any more facts or allegations than we hadn't seen before. It had some thoughts about the broad nature of China's approach to so-called state secrets.
So I frankly thought it wasn't worthy of some of the salacious reporting that we saw. It made no new fresh allegations, asserted no new facts, and dealt with an issue that we know has been there from the first moment. Which is that China takes a much wider view of State secrets than a country like Australia does, including commercial or economic matters or information.
LYNDAL CURTIS: Given, though, that China is willing to keep raising this matter publicly like this, does it make it harder to think that Mr Hu will get out of this quickly?
STEPHEN SMITH: I think it's now quite clear. And this is why I think in these matters, it's always best to proceed sensibly and methodically. It's now quite clear, given that the article has been taken off the website that it was essentially the opinion of the individual writer, and not if you like, officially sanctioned.
I don't think that it bears any great relevance on the Stern Hu case. We continue to make our representations to Chinese officials about Stern Hu. At the end of last week we had our second consular visit with him. We're very pleased to see that his health and welfare continues to be in good order.
We've reported on that visit to his employer and his family. And we continue to urge the Chinese authorities to deal with their investigation expeditiously.
The organisation which put that opinion piece on the website is neither an investigation or a prosecuting body. The key point we've been making to the Chinese authorities is they're undergoing an investigation. And that should be effected expeditiously. And if they're proposing to charge Stern Hu, that should be done sooner rather than later.
LYNDAL CURTIS: Were the consular officials able to do anything other in their visit than check on Mr Hu's health and well being?
STEPHEN SMITH: Well in accordance with the arrangements, we check on his well being. We're not in a position to discuss the details of his case or any possible charges against him. But we have raised both at that particular visit, and generally, the question of legal representation for Stern Hu.
LYNDAL CURTIS: But there's no movement on that yet.
STEPHEN SMITH: Under Chinese law, he's not entitled to legal representation until such time as he's charged, if indeed he is charged. We have made the point that we think legal representation would be appropriate, in advance of that, if it occurs.
LYNDAL CURTIS: But as far as you're aware at the moment, Mr Hu is being well treated?
STEPHEN SMITH: The advice I have from our consular officials is that he was well. He raised no welfare or medical issues. And obviously, we're very pleased about that. And we've relayed that to his family and to his employer.
LYNDAL CURTIS: Chinese diplomatic officials in Australia have pressured the National Press Club not to go ahead with today's address by the exiled Uygur Leader, Rebiya Kadeer. That follows on from China's… Chinese pressure on the Melbourne Film Festival not to show a film about her. Is that the way diplomatic officials should behave?
STEPHEN SMITH: I think there's a general point that needs to be made here. Embassies, diplomats, officials, are entitled to put views in Australian societies, but when they put those views, those views have to be put appropriately.
They can be put firmly. But they need to be put politely and appropriately. And for example, the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade received a complaint from the Lord Mayor of Melbourne about representations that he had received from Chinese officials about the showing of the Rebiya Kadeer film at the Melbourne Film Festival, and as a consequence of that, Chinese officials were spoken to by the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade.
So all diplomats need to conduct themselves appropriately.
LYNDAL CURTIS: So the Chinese may be being a little heavy handed in their complaints?
STEPHEN SMITH: Well I note from the Press Club itself that it makes the point that the representations about Ms Kadeer's appearance at the Press Club were firm but polite. I would have been much more concerned, frankly, if the Press Club had responded in any different way to those representations.
Diplomats in Australia are entitled to put a view, but that view needs to be put appropriately. And what all diplomats, of course, need to understand, is that Australia is a robust parliamentary democracy. We respect freedom of speech, and just because someone is given a platform and articulates a view, that doesn't mean, necessarily that the Australian people or the Australian Government or any parts of the Australian people necessarily agree with the view that is being put.
LYNDAL CURTIS: China talks about other countries not interfering in its internal affairs, yet it seems quite happy to meddle in Australia's. Is that an inconsistency you'd like to point out to them?
STEPHEN SMITH: I've made the point myself to my counterpart that when such representations are made, often what occurs is that the person that is subject of the representations gets much more publicity than would otherwise have been the case.
And I've made the point both directly and through officials that in Australian society, people are entitled to put a point of view, and just because they put a point of view doesn't mean the Australian Government necessarily agrees with it, or indeed the Australian people agree with it.
But part of our robust nature as a society includes the notion that foreign representatives of other nation States in Australia are also entitled to a view. If they're putting a view, that view needs to be put appropriately and when a view or a representation is not put appropriately, and a complaint is made, that is taken up by the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade, as it has on this occasion with respect to Chinese representations to the Lord Mayor of Melbourne.
LYNDAL CURTIS: But you wouldn't be seeking to follow up on the representations to the Press Club, because the Press Club hasn't complained about him.
STEPHEN SMITH: I've checked with the Department. The Department has received no complaint from the Press Club, and indeed, when I read the statement made by the Press Club, they say that representations were polite.
I would have been, as I say, much more concerned if the Press Club had responded in any different way. But I'd also suspect if you ask the Press Club that over the years, they would have received a number of representations suggesting that certain people shouldn't be given a platform. And those representations may well have applied to me and my colleagues. So I'm sure it's not the only occasion the Press Club has received a representation that someone shouldn't be given a platform. But the key thing here, of course, is on this occasion, the Press Club has made an eminently sensible decision and I'm sure they'll continue to do that.
LYNDAL CURTIS: Stephen Smith, thank you very much for your time.
STEPHEN SMITH: Thank you.
[ENDS]
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