E&OE
19 January 2009
Joint Media Conference – Perth
with Netherlands Foreign Minister Maxime Verhagen
Subjects: Australia-Netherlands relations; Afghanistan; Sri Lanka; Japanes whaling; Incoming Obama Administration; Harry Nicolaides on trial in Thailand; Illegal boat arrivals; Australians stranded in Fiji; Gaza; Netherlands troops in Afghanistan; Netherlands photographic exhibition.
SMITH: Thanks very much for attending.
Can I again officially welcome the Foreign Minister of the Netherlands, Maxime Verhagen to Australia, to Western Australia, and to Perth. And we're very pleased that Maxime's here as a Guest of Government.
His official duties started last night, where he and I both attended and observed the training of the Australian men's hockey team, the Kookaburras and the Netherlands' men's hockey team, who are about to start a four test match series.
And this, of course, reflects great competition between Australia and the Netherlands, when Australia won the Bronze Medal at the last Olympic Games and the Netherlands came fourth. When Australia won the Gold Medal at the previous Olympics in Athens, the Netherlands came second and won the Silver. But when the Netherlands won the Gold Medal in Sydney, we were eliminated in the semi-finals. So there's been intense competition between the two nations so far as hockey is concerned.
This morning we've had a formal bilateral meeting and we'll continue that over lunch. And, of course, as you'd be aware, we've just come from the official launching in Western Australia, and Australia, of the photographic exhibition.
Today, we started with the bilateral relationship between Australia and the Netherlands. This, of course, is now over 400 years old, with the first recorded touching by Dutch explorers on the North East Cape, on Cape York, in 1606.
But much more known and more generally appreciated than that, of course, is the extensive Dutch exploration on the coast of Western Australia, in the course of the 1600's. From Dirk Hartog slands to Cape William. And when I showed the Minister the view of the Swan River and Kings Park this morning, from the Commonwealth Parliamentary Offices, I observed to Maxime that if the Dutch had been more persistent, all of this could have been his.
But, of course, that contact, the modern relationship, the modern bilateral relationship starts in the World War II years, with the Dutch evacuation from South East Asia. The Dutch military, the Netherland's military command, of course, was operationed out of Brisbane. And since that time we've had very strong relations with the Netherlands.
It's not just a relationship which is touched by war. Of course, we are partners together in Oruzgan Province. But it's also touched by our strong commitment to multilaterism. We're both strong supporters of the United Nations and respecting international law and international norms. We value, very much, democracy and human rights and we work closely together in these international institutions.
The Netherlands is also a very significant investor in Australia. Of the European Union, which is our largest single investor, the Netherlands is the fourth largest investor, from the European Union, in Australia. And we look forward very much to working closely with the Netherlands in pursuit of the Australian/EU partnership framework which the French Foreign Minister Mr Kouchner, wearing his EU Presidency cap, and Australia presented, in Paris in October last year.
When it comes to Afghanistan, there's a sheer commitment, not just to a military contribution, to secure peace and security in Afghanistan, but also as our remarks, and as the photographic exhibition reflects, to the notion of building the capacity of the Afghan nation to take care of its own demands. To nation build, to build its capacity, whether that's police training, law and justice training; or whether it is development assistance. And this is a shared commitment that we discussed this morning.
In the course of our discussions today we, of course, broached a range of international and regional issues of interest to both Australia and the Netherlands and we will continue those discussions this afternoon.
From Perth, Maxime will travel to Sydney and will have meetings with my colleague, the Minister for Defence Joel Fitzgibbon and will also, later in the week, have a meeting with the Prime Minister and then travel to New Zealand.
So we're very pleased to, again, welcome you here Maxime. We've had very productive discussions this morning. I'll ask Maxime to make some remarks and then we're happy within the time available to respond to your questions. Thank you.
VERHAGEN:Thank you very much Stephen.
Ladies and gentlemen, I'm indeed very happy to be here in Australia, West Australia - Perth, as a guest of the Government, as a guest of my dear colleague Stephen Smith. And I would like to thank him for his warm hospitality and also I would like to thank him and Australia for the good cooperation and good discussions, bilateral talks we had this morning.
Australia and the Netherlands has indeed, as Stephen has underlined, strong historical and personal ties. Ties in the framework of relationship of trades, of commerce, but especially also shares the history from part of, not only of the Second World War, but from 400 years ago.
Only yesterday I visited the exhibition of Dutch ships that mapped your coasts and met with Dutch immigrants who found their new home here.
But our countries share much more. Indeed, as Stephen as underscored, we share the same values, have the same love of human rights, freedom and democracy. And we have the same determination to build a safer world. And in an uncertain time, when borders are disappearing, global economy is in turmoil, Stephen and I agree that an active foreign policy, based on these values, is a necessity to maintain our countries security and prosperity. We may live far apart, but our interests and priorities are closely aligned.
Australia and the Netherlands work together to fight climate change - the Low Countries, rising sea levels are a threat, but here in Australia, higher temperatures with diminishing rainfall here. So it's also a combined interest to work together to stop the climate change. And as committed [indistinct] indeed, Australia and the Netherlands work together to make, for example, to the United Nations more efficient and relevant.
As we see nowadays, in a globalised world and the balance of power is in our world is shifting. So we will also discuss, together, how to create a UN where all countries feel represented and willing to discuss level principles and rules.
And, of course, as Stephen as pointed out, Australia and the Netherlands worked closely together to bring stability and development to Afghanistan. And I commend the Australian troops in Oruzgan for their bravery and professionalism. As I was able to witness myself in [indistinct] our militaries are cooperating very, very well.
Regrettable, we sometimes suffer casualties, as Australia did earlier this month. But we cannot allow Afghanistan to become a safe haven for international terrorists again. The bombings in Bali, Madrid and London remind us we must defend our security in a faraway place.
And in Oruzgan we follow together, Australia and the Netherlands, a comprehensive approach, as we call it, a 3-D approach, defence, diplomacy and development. So we discuss, we build and we defend the Afghan people from extremists if necessary. And in Oruzgan, as we have seen also the pictures at this exhibition, this approach is delivering results.
Stephen and I agree that the Afghans themselves should increasingly be responsible for security, public services and development. This is the key in the time to come. It was one of the main developments we discussed this morning, our cooperation in Afghanistan, as we will discuss further on elements of mutual concern and mutual interests. I'm convinced that as we share our values, share the normals[sic], share our conviction to fight for a better world, that we are allies not only in Afghanistan, but in a worldwide scale.
Thank you very much Stephen.
SMITH: Thank you.
Okay, we're happy to respond to your questions. We might get away really easily.
QUESTION: If I could ask you a question on Sri Lanka?
VERHAGEN:Yes.
QUESTION: Last October you said that the banning of the Tamil Tigers was under consideration. Has that moved on? And if there is a decision, why has it taken so long before their major allies have been [indistinct]
SMITH: It remains under consideration by the Attorney-General. That's the first point.
Secondly, since that time, of course, we've seen the Sri Lankan Government and its defence forces move to take the de facto capital of the LTTE, or the Tamil Tigers, Kilinochchi. And I've made the point, as a consequence of that, whilst we understand the significance of that, we continue to very strongly hold the view that the only solution in Sri Lanka, is not a military solution, but a political solution.
And we continue to urge a number of things in Sri Lanka. We continue to urge respect of human rights, and continue to urge respect of the capacity of NGOs to administer humanitarian assistance. And we continue to urge a political settlement, by the military, ongoing enforcement activity.
QUESTION: Just on whaling, what's your response to the proposal by the Canberra panel to invite the Antarctic treaty [indistinct] against whaling in Antarctica versus…
SMITH: Well as you know, the Australian Government is strongly opposed to the Japanese whaling in the great Southern Oceans. We've made that point. We're pursuing all diplomatic efforts, both bilateral and multilateral through the International Whaling Commission, to seek to persuade Japan to abide by that view.
We've also made it clear that we have legal action in contemplation if those diplomatic efforts fail.
I've seen reference to the so-called Canberra Panel report. I haven't had the opportunity to examine its report and its recommendations in detail. It's obviously something which the Government will consider. But our approach on whaling continues to be an objective, by diplomatic means, to have the Japanese Government desist from whaling in the Great Southern Oceans.
QUESTION: Isn't it true though that the measures that you've been trying at the International Whaling Committee have failed?
SMITH: Well what is true is two things: firstly, that we've put more effort and energy into this over 12 months than our predecessors did over 12 years; and secondly, we continue to urge our view upon the Japanese. And I made the point when I was last in Japan, which was the middle of December last year, to my counterpart Foreign Minister Nakasone that we weren't successful in dissuading Japan either through bilateral efforts or through multilateral effort.
But we continued to hold out the prospect or the possibility of legal action, either before the International Tribunal for the Law of the Sea, or before the international courts.
QUESTION: So what - at what point does that become an option? I mean, it's an election…
SMITH: Well, when we come to the conclusion the diplomatic efforts have failed in consideration to legal action.
We've made that point clear to…
QUESTION: How far away do you think that is?
SMITH: Well we consider these things as time goes by. But we've urged the Japanese to desist from whaling in the great Southern Oceans. We're disappointed they're continuing in the course of this whaling season.
And it continues to be a matter of high diplomatic contact between the two nations.
QUESTION: Do you think that you'll see legal action this year?
SMITH: Well I'm not proposing to put a timetable on it.
QUESTION: If I could just ask one more question on Sri Lanka. Again, why is it taking so long to make up your mind about the Tamil Tigers, and do you have any comment on reports that the Tamil Tigers are using civilians as human shields? And I'm told, tens of thousands.
SMITH: Well again, I've seen those reports in the media. We're not in a capacity to give any independent verification of them. But we have particularly urged all participants to the conflict in Sri Lanka to respect human rights.
That would necessarily include not using civilians as human shields, but to respect human rights, and also to enable humanitarian assistance to be delivered.
In terms of timetables, when you have a difficult conflict, as Sri Lanka is, these things require careful judgments and careful assistance. And that matter continues to be under consideration by the Attorney-General.
QUESTION: Just in terms of the Obama Administration, you've managed to foster a good relationship with the US, and [indistinct]. Are you expecting that relationship to continue?
SMITH: Well the incoming Obama Administration was one of the matters that Maxine and I spoke about this morning, and we quite rightly have had professional and good personal relations with the Bush Administration. And that will continue, if only for another 24 hours.
And late last week, late Thursday night, I had yet another conversation with Secretary of State Rice over matters of mutual interest.
I'm looking very much forward to working closely, both in a personal and professional sense, with Secretary of State designate Clinton. Her confirmation hearing, of course, has already been conducted.
But once the operation is officially in place, we look forward to good and productive relations. I've often said that Governments in Australia come and go, and the Administrations in the United States come and go.
So far as Australia is concerned, the Alliance between Australia and the United States continues. So we expect in the course of the first half of this year to make all those necessary personal contacts - not just with Secretary of State designate Clinton, but her Deputies and her Assistants and other key personnel, and that will be done in the usual way to maximise the benefits of the relationship between Australia and the United States.
I think it's true to say that both Maxine and I are looking forward to the Inauguration, looking forward to the new US Administration being in place, because we do see the new Administration offering the prospect of fresh energy and a fresh approach to longstanding, difficult problems, including the Middle East, which was one of the matters that we discussed today.
QUESTION: Just on Harry Nicolaides, what's Australia doing to help him [indistinct]?
SMITH: Well he's been given consular assistance from the first moment that he was detained. Our officers, when he's appeared in court, have been in court on the occasions that he's appeared. And that's occurring today.
I'm not in the position to give an update on what occurred in today's court hearings because it's essentially coinciding with our press conference today.
We're continuing to ensure that he's got access to legal advice, we continue to give him and his family consular assistance, both him in Thailand and his family in Australia.
And we've made the point to the Thai authorities that this is a case of intense interest to the Australian Government.
I've seen the reported remarks of the new Thai Prime Minister in respect of the lese majeste as an offence generally.
Whether that will have any impact upon Mr Nicolaides' case, time will tell, but we continue to render him whatever assistance we can.
I do make the point that when an Australian is travelling overseas and they're charged with an offence under that nation-states' laws, there's a limit to what Australia can do to assist when a person is involved in the legal and judicial processes of another country, we continue to render whatever assistance we can.
And we continue to make representations on his behalf to the Thai authorities.
QUESTION: Given it's a freedom of speech issue, have you expressed disapproval to the Thai Government about this challenge?
SMITH: Well I've indicated to my previous Thai counterpart, former Foreign Minister Saroj, this was was a case of interest to Australia; that Australia respected the judicial and legal processes of Thailand; that he'd been charged with a criminal offence.
We were insuring that he had access to legal advice. But we were also insuring
that he was rendered whatever assistance we could.
Irrespective of what a view might be about the particular charge, the point
is this: it is an offence under Thai law and Australia respects Thai laws, and
we respect the fact that one of our citizens is going through a legal and judicial
process, and as I again, I underline and make the point that when Australians
travel overseas, they are bound by the laws of the country in which they travel.
And when a person is charged with a criminal offence, whatever the view might be about that offence, when someone who is an Australian is charged with a criminal offence in an overseas country, there's a limit to our capacity to help.
On this occasion, we have helped consistently, since his detention, by ensuring he had access to legal advice, and also ensuring that he had all of the available consular assistance that we could render to him.
QUESTION: What's the Australian Government's view on that charge, though? [Indistinct]
problem?
SMITH: The Australian Government's view on that charge is that it is an offence
under Thai law. An Australian citizen who's travelling to Thailand has been
charged under that law, and he is subject to the judicial and legal processes
of Thailand. And we've ensured that he has available to him legal advice. And
we're rendering him and his family every consular assistance, which we've done
from the first moment of his detention.
QUESTION: The latest unannounced boat arrivals, [indistinct]…
SMITH: Sorry?
QUESTION: The latest unannounced boat arrivals showing [indistinct] again come out and said that your policy is failing because [indistinct]. Do you have any comment on the situation generally and what she said [indistinct]…
SMITH: I think the latest arrival's actually announced. I think my colleague Bob Debus announced details yesterday. So he's put out into the public arena the precise details. I make the point that I made previously: the fact that the boat was intercepted shows that the border security operations are in place, and are operating well.
What we are encountering is, because of the so-called push factors, with difficulties in countries to effectively to our north, whether that is Iraq, whether that is Afghanistan, whether that is Sri Lanka, the push factors are seeing people leaving those countries seeking to come to our shores - which is why we've been in intense conversations and negotiations with countries who are our neighbours, particularly Indonesia, to seek to stop boats before they come into Australian waters.
We've had a number of arrivals since September of last year. We put that down to three factors. The push factor that I've referred to; to the seasonable and climatic conditions. But we'd also put it down to the fact that regrettably, we think that the people smugglers are becoming much more efficient and much more skilful at their trade.
And we need to respond to that and we are: both by the operations that we've put in place in terms of our border security arrangements, but also with the cooperation that we've had with our neighbours, not just Indonesia but other relevant countries.
QUESTION: Could you give us any update on Australians stranded in Fiji?
SMITH: Well I spoke to the High Commissioner, our High Commissioner in Fiji, earlier this morning. He indicated to me that the climatic conditions are nothing like what they were last week. In other words, that as it was best as one can at this time of year, because it is a time where Fiji is subject to adverse climatic conditions, and at short notice; the climatic conditions are much better at the start of this week than they were last week, when the circumstances were quite acute.
We're not aware of any Australians who remain inconvenienced. As best we can put it, things are if you like back to business as usual in terms of access to the airport and flights in and out of the airport.
But we continue to make the point as the Australian Department of Foreign Affairs Travel Advisory has since, from memory, 2005, that from the months of November to April, Fiji can be subject to seriously adverse conditions, weather conditions. They can strike at short notice and can seriously disrupt transport arrangements.
QUESTION: I've only got one other question, and that's Gaza. Do you think that truce can hold?
SMITH: Well, Gaza was obviously an item that Maxime and I discussed this morning. Yesterday I welcomed the unilateral ceasefire by the Israeli Government. Today I welcome the indication of a ceasefire by Hamas. We hope that leads to fighting ceasing immediately. But we also hope that the cessation in fighting leads to a durable ceasefire.
We strongly support United Nations Security Council Resolution 1860 which has, as its hallmark, a durable and sustainable and fully effective ceasefire.
We think in the short-term that if that can be achieved. And we support the diplomatic efforts going into achieving that, that are occurring in Cairo under the auspices of the Egyptian Government, we strongly support that. But if that can be achieved, then that does, we think, set the scene for renewed efforts at the broader peace process. And I'm hopeful that will occur under the new United States Administration.
When we see these terrible tragedies, whether it's civilian victims in Gaza or civilian victims in Israel, these terrible tragedies will only stop historically if we can effect a two-nation solution: a nation state for Israel within defined borders, subject to peace and security; and a nation state for the Palestinian people under the same terms and conditions.
I think this is view which, in very general, in general terms that the Netherlands and the European Union share.
QUESTION: I just have question for the Minister…
SMITH: Well, I'm very pleased about that.
QUESTION: Minister, will Dutch troops be involved in Afghanistan after the planned 2010 withdrawal from Oruzgan Province?
VERHAGEN:That's the question which I expected, I must admit. It's clear that the Netherlands Government, the Netherlands Defence Forces, would stick to their promises.
We are committed first to lead in Oruzgan, to help rebuilding the province
in cooperation with Australia and other partners.
My government has stated clearly when we took the decision to stay in the Oruzgan
that we will end our role as a lead nation taskforce in 2010, the end of 2010.
It's also clear that the Netherlands will be involved in rebuilding Afghanistan
for many years to come.
It's too early at this stage to talk about the situation beyond 2010. There has been no discussion in the Dutch Government, let alone a decision of possible Dutch contribution past 2010 to ISAF.
So we kept our promises; we stick to our promises; we will be the lead nation until the end of 2010. That's the decision we have taken; other discussions or other decisions have not been taken.
QUESTION: Minister, this photographic exhibition, could you just tell us what is the significance of that exhibition? Why was it so important for you to commission that?
VERHAGEN:Well, when we started our contribution in ISAF, we, from the beginning, underlined the need not to have only a military approach but a comprehensive approach, the policy to ensure that government, that restructure rule of law in Afghanistan, development to ensure that respected for the population of Afghanistan, and so of course to guarantee security through our defence elements.
When we put to the newspapers in the Netherlands - and I am convinced that it will be more or less the same in Australia - the public sees pictures of soldiers, and they have the picture or the image that the developments in Afghanistan concentrate on militarism. And what we wanted to show is the results of another Afghanistan, that there is development, that there is a new Afghanistan, there is hope expected for the people. So that's not only a way to show Afghanistan, to show them pictures of soldiers, but to show them real Afghanistan.
That's the reason why we asked a photographer, Hans Stakelbeek, to show us also the other side of what is happening in Afghanistan.
SMITH: Thanks very much.
[Ends]
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